Wheldon Road

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Matt
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by Matt » 24 Nov 2021, 15:36

cogito ergo sum wrote: 24 Nov 2021, 15:22
Blackbulltiger wrote: 24 Nov 2021, 14:58 Really do think people are in dream land again if they think we will get 5million to 8million off Axiom
We need to dream because the status quo is dropping us further and further adrift. There has to be an answer somewhere because we are on borrowed time.
Surprised the media haven't touted a shared stadium yet, if Wakey are set to get £8m and us having something similar add in a few million in terms of a loan and you've probably got yourself a decent stadium for £20m (not adjusting for inflation but Doncaster was around that to build)
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by pat » 24 Nov 2021, 16:12

Thought that myself about the shared stadium Wakefield’s statement said there funds were already in place and there planning is not being seen till 16 December along with the Newmarket plans for we’re there stadium was going to be.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by Dunkirk Spirit » 24 Nov 2021, 16:39

The Firm wrote: 23 Nov 2021, 19:49
mart0042 wrote: 23 Nov 2021, 19:16
The Firm wrote: 23 Nov 2021, 18:40
tigerfeat wrote: 23 Nov 2021, 14:51
The Firm wrote: 23 Nov 2021, 14:47

Called it earlier in the thread. Now the fun starts and we have to fight for the very best deal possible.
How much extra could we get then I didn't think it would be anything like what's been planned for ...
Pretty much guaranteed that it won’t be the full amount but what that amount is depends on the profitability of what is going where the stadium should have been. Remember that stadium site now becomes new land for them to make money out of on top of what was already earmarked for the retail. So there is a tidy amount to be had if we’ve got the cojones to argue hard. And we should because we have a decent, albeit not perfect, position. The S106 remains in place and trying to circumvent it is not worth either the cost or the hassle to Axiom who have already spent plenty on the site getting it to this stage without any income from it. A change of use, basic architect drawings and a re-hash of the same surveys already carried out is much cheaper, quicker and easier. It is in their interest as much as ours. Wakey are getting between £8-9 Million from their developer. Depending what plans are put forward i see no reason why there should be a great deal of difference here. Then £2m from the council and apply for every sports & community development grant going and we could have £12 million to do the old girl up.
I really can't see wakey getting 8-9m from the Newmarket job. Especially as the s106 was not attached and so could get out free.

We have got one and for a ground that would cost 15m, if they want us is to give it up, they could give us 14m, they'd be saving money

It's a win win for us.
Wakey are getting £8-9 Million, the figure is in the planning details.
Paragraph from the Newmarket Developers application. The only reason they will pay is because The plot 8 site they want to build on, still has planning permission for the community stadium, and are prepared to pay the compensation, I believe Castleford have a similar deal with Aximon, therefore I think they would have to pay your club to get the stadium planning removed from that site

11.7 The financial contribution demonstrated by the viability appraisal to be affordable of £8.3m is sufficient to fund the works at Belle Vue proposed to be undertaken by Newmarket Lane Limited (the works are subject to a planning application which is being concurrently with this application). and hence capable of delivering the financial contribution to the works cost. Newmarket Lane Limited will let the contract for those works and will be the employer under that contract. It is envisaged that the contract will be let in late 2021 with a 12 month construction period. Newmarket Lane Limited and its contractor will be granted a licence by Spirit of 1873 Limited to enter onto the ground at Belle Vue for the purposes of carrying out those works. The Spirit of 1873 Limited will fund and appoint the contractor for carrying out the works that it has identified as carrying out. Between Newmarket Lane Limited and the Spirit of 1873 Limited, the entire works package will be delivered.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by Piquad1 » 24 Nov 2021, 17:48

Yes and the clock is well and truly ticking.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by Scoopage » 24 Nov 2021, 22:02

I’ve not renewed this season,they can have my money for saints game,il be paying on gate for games not on a Monday Tuesday Wednesday or Thursday

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by mart0042 » 25 Nov 2021, 11:20

It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by tigerfeat » 25 Nov 2021, 11:24

We will have a good idea with what Wakey get if it's the figure Dunkirk Spirit put in his post around 8 or 9 million that's what I would be looking at
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by derbystiger » 25 Nov 2021, 12:32

Give Axiom the plans on what we want doing to WR - tell them to get it done and then, when it’s complete, inspected and signed off as satisfactory we’ll hand over to them the 2 million as our contribution.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by lurcher » 25 Nov 2021, 14:58

mart0042 wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 11:20 It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.
100% agree mate, Axiom have apparently spent £13 million on the project so far so a further £10 million would be chicken feed to them.
Otherwise perhaps they should consider changing their name again as Axiom = "an accepted truth or principle".
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by Blackbulltiger » 25 Nov 2021, 15:06

mart0042 wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 11:20 It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.
Who ever owns Axiam this false company have played the waiting game once the present planning runs out in about 12months a think .They can put in different planning for the site we won't get a penny off them Castleford no this why they have given up on it and excepted the two million from council but what are you going do with just 2million won't be alot on the ground it's self .
Last edited by Blackbulltiger on 25 Nov 2021, 15:10, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by Blackbulltiger » 25 Nov 2021, 15:09

Blackbulltiger wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:06
mart0042 wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 11:20 It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.
Who ever owns Axiam this false company have played the waiting game once the present planning runs out in about 12months a think .They can put in different planning for the site we won't get a penny off them Castleford no this why they have given up on it and excepted the two million from council but what are you going do with just 2million won't be alot on the ground it's self .

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by lurcher » 25 Nov 2021, 15:20

Blackbulltiger wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:06
mart0042 wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 11:20 It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.
Who ever owns Axiam this false company have played the waiting game once the present planning runs out in about 12months a think .They can put in different planning for the site we won't get a penny off them Castleford no this why they have given up on it and excepted the two million from council but what are you going do with just 2million won't be alot on the ground it's self .
they can put in for it, getting it granted is another thing all together
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by yorky » 25 Nov 2021, 15:22

i just hope it doesn't all end up in tears again, how many more times will hopes & dreams be broken.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by tigerfeat » 25 Nov 2021, 15:25

Blackbulltiger wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:06
mart0042 wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 11:20 It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.
Who ever owns Axiam this false company have played the waiting game once the present planning runs out in about 12months a think .They can put in different planning for the site we won't get a penny off them Castleford no this why they have given up on it and excepted the two million from council but what are you going do with just 2million won't be alot on the ground it's self .
But surely Cas wouldn't have made the statement it did on Monday about the developers wanting to bring forward what they wanted to do on the land if they didn't all ready know there was going to be a payment to the club to upgrade Wheldon Road
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by pat » 25 Nov 2021, 15:34

You would have thought they had a idea what they were going to get before they put the statement out .will we have to waite again for axiom to find the units to fill the site.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by old cas lass » 25 Nov 2021, 15:41

yorky wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:22 i just hope it doesn't all end up in tears again, how many more times will hopes & dreams be broken.
Have got me box of tissues ready.

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by yorky » 25 Nov 2021, 16:07

old cas lass wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:41
yorky wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:22 i just hope it doesn't all end up in tears again, how many more times will hopes & dreams be broken.
Have got me box of tissues ready.
me too!

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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by Casmania » 25 Nov 2021, 16:48

lurcher wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:20
Blackbulltiger wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:06
mart0042 wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 11:20 It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.
Who ever owns Axiam this false company have played the waiting game once the present planning runs out in about 12months a think .They can put in different planning for the site we won't get a penny off them Castleford no this why they have given up on it and excepted the two million from council but what are you going do with just 2million won't be alot on the ground it's self .
they can put in for it, getting it granted is another thing all together
I was initially involved with the new stadium.
I can assure you WMDC are absolutely wanting this development to go ahead. They have been extremely supportive behind the scenes. The s106 agreement which virtually guarantees the stadium development came on the back of what the Newmarket developers did or should I say, fail to do what they said they would do.
Things have changed dramatically with respect to shopping. The significant obstacle to the whole development going ahead was the cost of the stadium, associated infrastructure, country park and the social fund.
Profit margins are even less now. Axiom would never get funding with such a millstone cost wise hanging over their heads.
I would imagine Axiom may challenge the s106 agreement or at least part of it. Or, has previously been stated, play the waiting game, and reapply for planning permission without the stadium. Even if the council reject pp - which is debatable - Axiom will appeal to the planning ombudsman.
The club went to lengths in the original planning application that staying and developing WR was a non starter. The costs are significant, the club have no money. Planning laws would make any development difficult and limited. Limited space, Parking would have to be increased etc. Where would the club play during the rebuild?

It is all very uncomfortable.
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by tigerfeat » 25 Nov 2021, 17:06

Havnt Wakefield gone down this route... but they stuck at it didn't give in and it looks like theve been rewarded
Unless we have that attitude to make sure we get what we want in the end we will have no chance
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Re: Wheldon Road

Post by FIat Capper » 25 Nov 2021, 17:38

tigerfeat wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:25
Blackbulltiger wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 15:06
mart0042 wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 11:20 It's a matter of who blinks first. Axiom can only open the shopping centre and park, after our new ground is completed and keys handed over. Why would we roll over for a few million, when we need either a new ground or WR bringing up to what will be needed to stay in super League?

If they want us to give up on the new stadium then they make the offer we can't refuse. I hope we have some good negotiators for this. This is a once in a generation chance.
Who ever owns Axiam this false company have played the waiting game once the present planning runs out in about 12months a think .They can put in different planning for the site we won't get a penny off them Castleford no this why they have given up on it and excepted the two million from council but what are you going do with just 2million won't be alot on the ground it's self .
But surely Cas wouldn't have made the statement it did on Monday about the developers wanting to bring forward what they wanted to do on the land if they didn't all ready know there was going to be a payment to the club to upgrade Wheldon Road
It wouldn't be the first time Cas have been drawn in hook, line a sinker only to be left out in the cold when push comes to shove.

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