Isn’t it marvellous..

[tigerfeat]

I saw Alex Foster up glasshoughton at tea time he looked to be walking freely no idea how far he is off playing but you know if he comes back playing well it will be like a new signing for us

[HuddsTigers]

...Made the play-offs 4 out of 6 seasons [2014 (4th), 2017 (1st), 2018 (3rd), 2019 (5th)]...

Think that's enough to sum up the cocerns of some who, IMO, aren't writing the club off but merely pointing out we've gone backewards and there no sign of that reversing. If we continue this trend we'll end up 7th and out of the play-offs which for a GFist 2 years ago is an abject failure.

But then by that logic we wouldn't have finished 1st in 2017 or shouldn't have done. It's gone 10th, 4th, 5th, 5th, 1st, 3rd, 5th.

We haven't dropped out the 5 with Powell in charge and that's with a squad decimated by injury last year too. We arguably *should* have finished higher given some of our losses last season too.

[nottinghamtiger]

I have faith in the club and Powell as always.

In six and a half years Powell has got us:
* 2 Finals
* 1 LLS
* Made the play-offs 4 out of 6 seasons [2014 (4th), 2017 (1st), 2018 (3rd), 2019 (5th)]
* Top 5 in six seasons (2015+2016 both finished 5th)

People kept writing us off including our own fans that we were going to regress or be one season wonders and every season he's disproved every single one of you critiquers wrong.

That's despite his best assets being sold off every single season, wanting to leave or getting themselves banned.

I have faith in Powell. Considering where we were before he came in, and the challenges he has faced in the time he has been at the club, he has delivered more than anyone could have hoped for.
But I don’t have faith in those running the club. They are sleepwalking into losing our SL status if (or maybe when) the RFL decide to reintroduce some kind of off-field criteria.
Our marketing is woeful, our admin systems belong in the 1980s and there is absolutely no strategic direction whatsoever. They’ve destroyed relationships with supporter groups who offered services for free, local community groups and schools.
The coaching staff and most players (in terms of how they promote the club) cannot be faulted. Those in management need to take a long, hard look in the mirror (in my opinion).

[Mysterio]

I have faith in the club and Powell as always.

In six and a half years Powell has got us:
* 2 Finals
* 1 LLS
* Made the play-offs 4 out of 6 seasons [2014 (4th), 2017 (1st), 2018 (3rd), 2019 (5th)]
* Top 5 in six seasons (2015+2016 both finished 5th)

People kept writing us off including our own fans that we were going to regress or be one season wonders and every season he's disproved every single one of you critiquers wrong.

That's despite his best assets being sold off every single season, wanting to leave or getting themselves banned.

I have faith in Powell. Considering where we were before he came in, and the challenges he has faced in the time he has been at the club, he has delivered more than anyone could have hoped for.
But I don’t have faith in those running the club. They are sleepwalking into losing our SL status if (or maybe when) the RFL decide to reintroduce some kind of off-field criteria.
Our marketing is woeful, our admin systems belong in the 1980s and there is absolutely no strategic direction whatsoever. They’ve destroyed relationships with supporter groups who offered services for free, local community groups and schools.
The coaching staff and most players (in terms of how they promote the club) cannot be faulted. Those in management need to take a long, hard look in the mirror (in my opinion).

This is exactly the kind of thing I was trying to articulate :clap:

[thedogvinnie]

.
You know, i can see a day coming when the superleague try and force Calder on us again, or relegate us cos our toiilets dont flush properly.

And the club would have nobody to blame but themselves.

Im curious, explain to me how the club with all its financial clout could have improved things and NOT gone the way Wakey have a few times and god forbid the way the Bulls still are, you never know, your superior knowledge may be picked up by the club and result in us getting the shiny [REMOVED] houses we deserve.

The club is Hamstrung by the glasshoughton white elephant and a council that prefers to pump all its brass into Wakefield Trinity ........ Where is our £3 million interest free loan? the old girl would scrub up well with £3 mill to play with dont ya think?

[nottinghamtiger]

.
You know, i can see a day coming when the superleague try and force Calder on us again, or relegate us cos our toiilets dont flush properly.

And the club would have nobody to blame but themselves.

Im curious, explain to me how the club with all its financial clout could have improved things and NOT gone the way Wakey have a few times and god forbid the way the Bulls still are, you never know, your superior knowledge may be picked up by the club and result in us getting the shiny [REMOVED] houses we deserve.

The club is Hamstrung by the glasshoughton white elephant and a council that prefers to pump all its brass into Wakefield Trinity ........ Where is our £3 million interest free loan? the old girl would scrub up well with £3 mill to play with dont ya think?

Well, for a start you could do some stuff pretty much on the cheap. There’s some basic stuff that costs little, but has a big impact. Locks on toilet doors, for example. Throwing some gravel down the path between the training pitch and the turnstiles so it doesn’t turn into a mud bath or a swimming pool.
Then I think we might be onto decent quality temporary toilets. The kind that are outside Old Trafford and other major stadiums. You could put a decent block up where the current toilets are behind the main stand for a start. There is obviously a cost involved, but I think there general “rule of thumb” is that there should be one individual cubicle toilet per every 500 people that attend an event (400 female and 100 male) and the equivalent number of urinals. That’s certainly the numbers we worked to when our toilet facilities were out of action where I used to work. So we aren’t talking massive numbers (and therefore costs) for only 14 days a year.
Then there’s the free labour the supporters’ club we’re willing to put into small jobs around the ground, that was rejected by the club. They did a great job of alienating and annoying the very people who were willing to help. I notice there will be a new Supporters Group next year - and I’ll bet money that some of those who were most committed to the CTSC aren’t allowed to join.
You’re right though, the club have been wrong to blindly assume that the GH project will come to fruition. It might one day, but until then they have taken their eye off the ball in terms of what we actually have now.
I’ve said it before, the club have been too busy fixating on the future, whilst perilously ignoring the present.

[HuddsTigers]

Or they have just been managing their resources into putting out a decent first team for people to watch. Can have the best facilities in the world but if the product is rubbish, no one will want to come watch it then.

Personally, I think we should back DP as much as we can and invest in the playing staff and coaching staff, as well as the technology to help improve the first team. I'd much rather have that for now.

From my perspective, we should be approaching local businesses to help do the work and giving them some kind of sponsorship in return. Imagine having a decent toilet block built with the logo of a brand emblazoned down the side of it with visibility to say 80,000 people a season plus whatever you can get on social media. Let's be honest, we're going to be here 2 more years probably.

We've got a few already in CBR Engineering who have done a lot of work for us. There must be more of those locally or around Yorkshire that would benefit from working with us and our audience, without sacrificing existing revenue streams?

As for the help, how do we know it was rejected? There is a difference between just not taking up the offer and flat out rejecting it. And you can understand the logic of not letting people invest time into doing loads of work that could be torn up in a few years. The club say they have a plan B and that's good enough for me, and all of this is fairly quick paced stuff that can be put into place fairly quickly I'd imagine. However, there is probably a significant cost of doing any major works to Wheldon Road itself, as it won't just be cosmetic changes.

Until then we work with what we've got and manage our resources properly. The club is breaking even or profitable and that's all we can ask for.

[Johnlewis1920]

H/T regards breaking even or making a profit I am surprised you have not looked on companies house and seen the latest accounts for the club without the bonus of Wembley / old Trafford and extra sky money it appears more clearer that the on field team have been disguising the off fields performance COYF

[nottinghamtiger]

Or they have just been managing their resources into putting out a decent first team for people to watch. Can have the best facilities in the world but if the product is rubbish, no one will want to come watch it then.

This is the part I just don’t buy. This line of “we’re investing in the playing squad” rather than facilities just doesn’t add up for one reason - the salary cap.
By its very nature, we can’t “invest” in the playing squad more than we have done. We were paying up the cap in 2015 and continue to do so. That’s not investment, that’s maintaining the same expenditure.
It could be argued that we have invested in the squad in terms of transfer fees. But the fees we have received (Solomona, Gale, Chase, Carney, McLelland, Johnson) I suspect far outweigh the fees we have paid out (Watts, Hardaker, Mata’utia, Richardson), so again it’s not really investment.
And the thing is, you can usually watch the product on TV without going to WR. How many home games did we have last year that weren’t televised? You can have the best product in the world, but if people can watch it in their own home then you need to give them a reason to go to the expense and effort of coming to watch it live - and at the moment, the game-day experience simply isn’t worth the expense. I guess whether it’s worth the effort depends on how easy it is for individuals to actually get to WR.

[tigerfeat]

Or they have just been managing their resources into putting out a decent first team for people to watch. Can have the best facilities in the world but if the product is rubbish, no one will want to come watch it then.

Personally, I think we should back DP as much as we can and invest in the playing staff and coaching staff, as well as the technology to help improve the first team. I'd much rather have that for now.

From my perspective, we should be approaching local businesses to help do the work and giving them some kind of sponsorship in return. Imagine having a decent toilet block built with the logo of a brand emblazoned down the side of it with visibility to say 80,000 people a season plus whatever you can get on social media. Let's be honest, we're going to be here 2 more years probably.

We've got a few already in CBR Engineering who have done a lot of work for us. There must be more of those locally or around Yorkshire that would benefit from working with us and our audience, without sacrificing existing revenue streams?

As for the help, how do we know it was rejected? There is a difference between just not taking up the offer and flat out rejecting it. And you can understand the logic of not letting people invest time into doing loads of work that could be torn up in a few years. The club say they have a plan B and that's good enough for me, and all of this is fairly quick paced stuff that can be put into place fairly quickly I'd imagine. However, there is probably a significant cost of doing any major works to Wheldon Road itself, as it won't just be cosmetic changes.

Until then we work with what we've got and manage our resources properly. The club is breaking even or profitable and that's all we can ask for.

Where are we going to be after two more years then ??

[HuddsTigers]

Or they have just been managing their resources into putting out a decent first team for people to watch. Can have the best facilities in the world but if the product is rubbish, no one will want to come watch it then.

This is the part I just don’t buy. This line of “we’re investing in the playing squad” rather than facilities just doesn’t add up for one reason - the salary cap.
By its very nature, we can’t “invest” in the playing squad more than we have done. We were paying up the cap in 2015 and continue to do so. That’s not investment, that’s maintaining the same expenditure.
It could be argued that we have invested in the squad in terms of transfer fees. But the fees we have received (Solomona, Gale, Chase, Carney, McLelland, Johnson) I suspect far outweigh the fees we have paid out (Watts, Hardaker, Mata’utia, Richardson), so again it’s not really investment.
And the thing is, you can usually watch the product on TV without going to WR. How many home games did we have last year that weren’t televised? You can have the best product in the world, but if people can watch it in their own home then you need to give them a reason to go to the expense and effort of coming to watch it live - and at the moment, the game-day experience simply isn’t worth the expense. I guess whether it’s worth the effort depends on how easy it is for individuals to actually get to WR.

Depends on your definition of investing in the playing squad. Mine is being able to keep funding the salary cap, which we haven't been able to do until recent years. There is a limit in rugby league. The club will not (coaching decision) go towards a marquee player and has said they'd need more fans to be able to sustainably do it anyway. Therefore, our expectation should be for the club to keep to maintain their level spending.

We could pull the plug on the playing squad, save £300k-£400k a year, build a pretty toilet block but there's more chance of us getting relegated doing that and people will complain about the quality of the playing squad then. The money has to come from somewhere and no matter what the club does, fans will moan and they cannot win.

It's swings and roundabouts. And there's more to product than nice toilets too. The atmosphere last season was atrocious for most of it, the game is becoming dull as dishwater (not necessarily just Cas). The whole entity of rugby league isn't good enough. The reality is that the sport should sustainably be able to run itself on TV money alone (it doesn't), with the club being able to invest corporate/merchandise/fans income into areas they want to improve and grow.

[HuddsTigers]

Where are we going to be after two more years then ??

Hopefully Glasshoughton!

[HuddsTigers]

H/T regards breaking even or making a profit I am surprised you have not looked on companies house and seen the latest accounts for the club without the bonus of Wembley / old Trafford and extra sky money it appears more clearer that the on field team have been disguising the off fields performance COYF

We made a small loss in 2018 of around £40k. It's near enough break even and far better than a lot of our rivals who are losing £150k+ a season (e.g. Wigan).

And it's a damn sight better than 10 years ago that's for sure!

[Tamworth Tiger]

I don’t think Hudds and Nottingham are far apart.
I’ve no idea how long the ground is going to take. The club have been talking about it since 1999.
I personally love it, as do my family. The playing surface, the closeness of the fans to the ground, the atmosphere are all fantastic. The capacity is fine and the prematch experience is miles better than in the plastic modern stadia where fans are kept apart. Parking is also pretty good.
The toilets though are an embarrassment. They have been for many years and it’s not possible to defend them without sounding ridiculous.
The ground is going one way or another in the long run. It would be too expensive to knock down and rebuild even in stages.
I agree with Hudds that if not with volunteers( I believe that a number have been treated pretty badly over the years but they could still be cultivated) or through a sponsorship deal with a local firm or College, possibly linked to Apprentices, some improvements could be made. A bit of thinking outside the box could get rid of a huge amount of criticism and make the ground much more family friendly.

[casjunction]

This thread was l think originally about our recruitment or lack of for next season.
It has subsequently meandered to talk on several levels which players and coaches exempted suggests the club and it's management are not fit for purpose.
The media, marketing, merchandising, corporate facilities down to the basics are not fit for purpose.
We put uo with them but are doing so in decreasing numbers.
It may be over exposure on TV.
Family Finance. An ageing customer base unwilling to put up with facilities which are substandard.
Any business run in this way faces demishing returns.
Which bring us back to recruitment or lack of.
It must be a heck of job to sell the nerits of playing for Cas at the best of times.
Do we moan or just express a valid opinion.
Which ever we need to be lustened to and not taken for granted.
If you look at the age profile the full paying and youngsters will soon be outnumbered by us older folk.
See you all next season, hopefully.

[lurcher]

H/T regards breaking even or making a profit I am surprised you have not looked on companies house and seen the latest accounts for the club without the bonus of Wembley / old Trafford and extra sky money it appears more clearer that the on field team have been disguising the off fields performance COYF

We made a small loss in 2018 of around £40k. It's near enough break even and far better than a lot of our rivals who are losing £150k+ a season (e.g. Wigan).

And it's a damn sight better than 10 years ago that's for sure!

they lost £1.4 million in 2018, the year they won the grand final and received the bateman money. thats on top of losses for previous years.

[mart0042]

H/T regards breaking even or making a profit I am surprised you have not looked on companies house and seen the latest accounts for the club without the bonus of Wembley / old Trafford and extra sky money it appears more clearer that the on field team have been disguising the off fields performance COYF

We made a small loss in 2018 of around £40k. It's near enough break even and far better than a lot of our rivals who are losing £150k+ a season (e.g. Wigan).

And it's a damn sight better than 10 years ago that's for sure!

they lost £1.4 million in 2018, the year they won the grand final and received the bateman money. thats on top of losses for previous years.

It's amazing we can be in the top 5 on a regular basis and keep making a profit with the corporate being relatively small. A new ground would mean marquee. We just need it to be built.

[Johnlewis1920]

H/T I was pointing out your misleading statement regards the clubs finances
I hope we all support Castleford Tigers I do not get any comfort that our club did not lose as much as other clubs for any one to do so is a recipe for disaster in my opinion COYF

[thedogvinnie]

Where are we going to be after two more years then ??

Hopefully Glasshoughton!

Dont hold your breath mate

I dont believe GH will ever happen, especially if we exit the EU but thats another issue

[HuddsTigers]

H/T I was pointing out your misleading statement regards the clubs finances
I hope we all support Castleford Tigers I do not get any comfort that our club did not lose as much as other clubs for any one to do so is a recipe for disaster in my opinion COYF

It isn't misleading. We have made a profit or have been break even for the past 5 or 6 years. Doesn't matter how we did it, the fact is we did it. And arguably with higher costs too.

2018 didn't see us make either final and we lost around £40k.

We can always do better but in the context of RL and sport in general, anything that is a profit or remotely near a profit is a decent result.

There are a number of areas we can improve significantly and digital is one of them.