2020 Squad

All things related to the Castleford Tigers.
tigerfeat
Dale Fritz
Posts: 7459
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:07 pm

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by tigerfeat » Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:17 am

I agree to a certain extent but most people thought matautia was a good signing most people thought Blair was a good signing most people agreed it was correct to extend the contracts of the likes of Eden Mcshane Milner Massey and co after 2017 Wardle was playing well in the Nrl
I don't think Wells is the right man in place I've said that before but it's only fair to point out it's easy to be wise after the event
The measure of who we are is what we do with what we have
Vince Lombardi

chief193
Kirk Dixon
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 12:50 am

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by chief193 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:23 am

braytontiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 8:55 am
chief193 wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 8:50 am
The comparisons to 1999 are scary, now like then the core of our good team are drifting away to be replaced with sub standard replacements. The final straw back is 2002 was when Danny Orr left us to be replaced with an aging half who ultimately got injured early and we never recovered leading to our relegation. Luke has just left!!!
Super league was stale in 2016 and had become a boring forwards game as popularised by Wigan and Hull, in 2017 we caught everyone out with a brand of passing rugby that everyone else who had brought in big packs couldn’t cope with. Everyone plays the way we did now it’s just a fact that the clubs above us have brought in better players than us in the key roles of the system we popularised.
Correct add in that Stuart raper also failed to see the importance of youth development. Certainly is history repeating it’s self, I’m not sure it will end in relegation this time but it could. With Toronto coming in and both Leeds and HKR. Getting their act together somebody as to go and the margins are that close it really could be anyone who takes their eye off the ball or they become complacent.
I agree I don’t really see us being relegated but a few games either way this year and we would have been in the mix down there. Ifs and buts I know as a few games the other way and we could have been second.
The general quality of SL this year has been poor, with the exception of STs every team has had a really bad patch where they looked awful, we just need to be very wary that everyone else steps on and we don’t

nottinghamtiger
Luke Gale
Posts: 3382
Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:17 pm

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by nottinghamtiger » Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:37 am

tigerfeat wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:17 am
I agree to a certain extent but most people thought matautia was a good signing most people thought Blair was a good signing most people agreed it was correct to extend the contracts of the likes of Eden Mcshane Milner Massey and co after 2017 Wardle was playing well in the Nrl
I don't think Wells is the right man in place I've said that before but it's only fair to point out it's easy to be wise after the event
I agree to some extent. My issue has been retention rather than recruitment, and the length of contracts that we gave average or injury-prone players.
James Clare had his contract extended after only playing nine game. Why did we give him a two-year deal to the end of 2021 after only nine games?
Ollie Holmes got a contract extension in early 2018 that takes him to the end of 2021. He had only played 14 games in 2016 and 11 games in 2017. It was madness to give a player who had played so few games such a long contract, and no surprise he’s barely played this year.
Alex Foster - where do we start? He signed a two year contract in 2017 that took him to the end of 2019. For some bizarre reason, we then gave him another contract in 2018, even though he still had over eighteen months on his current deal! Why? We’ve given him a deal to the end of 2021 after such a short time at the club, and when he was under contract anyway! Since he signed his most recent contract, he’s played 6 games. If we hadn’t rushed in with an unnecessary contract, we would have had much more flexibility.
Michael Shenton - giving any player a three year contract that doesn’t end until he is 36 is just ridiculous. He deserved to continue his career at the time he signed his contract, but we should have learnt from Andy Lynch how quickly excellent players can deteriorate with age. Three years was just stupid.
Unfortunately, retentions and recruitment go hand-in-hand. In a salary-capped sport, retaining a player has a direct impact on a club’s ability to recruit new ones. We’ve tied our hands by giving long contracts to players who quite frankly hadn’t earned them.

Tamworth Tiger
Michael Eagar
Posts: 4074
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2006 4:29 pm

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by Tamworth Tiger » Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:41 am

chief193 wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 8:50 am
The comparisons to 1999 are scary, now like then the core of our good team are drifting away to be replaced with sub standard replacements. The final straw back is 2002 was when Danny Orr left us to be replaced with an aging half who ultimately got injured
Who was the half? Remember Mitch Healey around that time but didn’t he come in and play alongside Danny for a while and stayed after he left. I thought he was OK, so who was the other one, Sheridan?
Image

classycas57
Dean Widders
Posts: 336
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:04 pm

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by classycas57 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:46 am

nottinghamtiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:37 am
tigerfeat wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:17 am
I agree to a certain extent but most people thought matautia was a good signing most people thought Blair was a good signing most people agreed it was correct to extend the contracts of the likes of Eden Mcshane Milner Massey and co after 2017 Wardle was playing well in the Nrl
I don't think Wells is the right man in place I've said that before but it's only fair to point out it's easy to be wise after the event
I agree to some extent. My issue has been retention rather than recruitment, and the length of contracts that we gave average or injury-prone players.
James Clare had his contract extended after only playing nine game. Why did we give him a two-year deal to the end of 2021 after only nine games?
Ollie Holmes got a contract extension in early 2018 that takes him to the end of 2021. He had only played 14 games in 2016 and 11 games in 2017. It was madness to give a player who had played so few games such a long contract, and no surprise he’s barely played this year.
Alex Foster - where do we start? He signed a two year contract in 2017 that took him to the end of 2019. For some bizarre reason, we then gave him another contract in 2018, even though he still had over eighteen months on his current deal! Why? We’ve given him a deal to the end of 2021 after such a short time at the club, and when he was under contract anyway! Since he signed his most recent contract, he’s played 6 games. If we hadn’t rushed in with an unnecessary contract, we would have had much more flexibility.
Michael Shenton - giving any player a three year contract that doesn’t end until he is 36 is just ridiculous. He deserved to continue his career at the time he signed his contract, but we should have learnt from Andy Lynch how quickly excellent players can deteriorate with age. Three years was just stupid.
Unfortunately, retentions and recruitment go hand-in-hand. In a salary-capped sport, retaining a player has a direct impact on a club’s ability to recruit new ones. We’ve tied our hands by giving long contracts to players who quite frankly hadn’t earned them.
Couldn't agree more notts

duke street 10
Danny Orr
Posts: 1648
Joined: Sun Jun 07, 2009 3:22 pm
Location: glasshoughton,our new home?

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by duke street 10 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:56 am

Tamworth Tiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:41 am
chief193 wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 8:50 am
The comparisons to 1999 are scary, now like then the core of our good team are drifting away to be replaced with sub standard replacements. The final straw back is 2002 was when Danny Orr left us to be replaced with an aging half who ultimately got injured
Who was the half? Remember Mitch Healey around that time but didn’t he come in and play alongside Danny for a while and stayed after he left. I thought he was OK, so who was the other one, Sheridan?
I remember Sheridan didn't play much around that time. There was Sean Rudder for a short spell,we tried Andy Kain for a while as well.

duke street 10
Danny Orr
Posts: 1648
Joined: Sun Jun 07, 2009 3:22 pm
Location: glasshoughton,our new home?

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by duke street 10 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:59 am

classycas57 wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:46 am
nottinghamtiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:37 am
tigerfeat wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:17 am
I agree to a certain extent but most people thought matautia was a good signing most people thought Blair was a good signing most people agreed it was correct to extend the contracts of the likes of Eden Mcshane Milner Massey and co after 2017 Wardle was playing well in the Nrl
I don't think Wells is the right man in place I've said that before but it's only fair to point out it's easy to be wise after the event
I agree to some extent. My issue has been retention rather than recruitment, and the length of contracts that we gave average or injury-prone players.
James Clare had his contract extended after only playing nine game. Why did we give him a two-year deal to the end of 2021 after only nine games?
Ollie Holmes got a contract extension in early 2018 that takes him to the end of 2021. He had only played 14 games in 2016 and 11 games in 2017. It was madness to give a player who had played so few games such a long contract, and no surprise he’s barely played this year.
Alex Foster - where do we start? He signed a two year contract in 2017 that took him to the end of 2019. For some bizarre reason, we then gave him another contract in 2018, even though he still had over eighteen months on his current deal! Why? We’ve given him a deal to the end of 2021 after such a short time at the club, and when he was under contract anyway! Since he signed his most recent contract, he’s played 6 games. If we hadn’t rushed in with an unnecessary contract, we would have had much more flexibility.
Michael Shenton - giving any player a three year contract that doesn’t end until he is 36 is just ridiculous. He deserved to continue his career at the time he signed his contract, but we should have learnt from Andy Lynch how quickly excellent players can deteriorate with age. Three years was just stupid.
Unfortunately, retentions and recruitment go hand-in-hand. In a salary-capped sport, retaining a player has a direct impact on a club’s ability to recruit new ones. We’ve tied our hands by giving long contracts to players who quite frankly hadn’t earned them.
Couldn't agree more notts
On top of the good post by Notts, we have question marks over the overseas quota, Will Jesse come back?, will Blair improve?, will Millington & Moors make it through 2020?, is Pete M worth a quota place?

chief193
Kirk Dixon
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 12:50 am

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by chief193 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:05 am

Tamworth Tiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 10:41 am
chief193 wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 8:50 am
The comparisons to 1999 are scary, now like then the core of our good team are drifting away to be replaced with sub standard replacements. The final straw back is 2002 was when Danny Orr left us to be replaced with an aging half who ultimately got injured
Who was the half? Remember Mitch Healey around that time but didn’t he come in and play alongside Danny for a while and stayed after he left. I thought he was OK, so who was the other one, Sheridan?
It was Sheridan mate, busted his shoulder at Hull in the cup and never player again for us

chief193
Kirk Dixon
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 12:50 am

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by chief193 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:06 am

nottinghamtiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:37 am
tigerfeat wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:17 am
I agree to a certain extent but most people thought matautia was a good signing most people thought Blair was a good signing most people agreed it was correct to extend the contracts of the likes of Eden Mcshane Milner Massey and co after 2017 Wardle was playing well in the Nrl
I don't think Wells is the right man in place I've said that before but it's only fair to point out it's easy to be wise after the event
I agree to some extent. My issue has been retention rather than recruitment, and the length of contracts that we gave average or injury-prone players.
James Clare had his contract extended after only playing nine game. Why did we give him a two-year deal to the end of 2021 after only nine games?
Ollie Holmes got a contract extension in early 2018 that takes him to the end of 2021. He had only played 14 games in 2016 and 11 games in 2017. It was madness to give a player who had played so few games such a long contract, and no surprise he’s barely played this year.
Alex Foster - where do we start? He signed a two year contract in 2017 that took him to the end of 2019. For some bizarre reason, we then gave him another contract in 2018, even though he still had over eighteen months on his current deal! Why? We’ve given him a deal to the end of 2021 after such a short time at the club, and when he was under contract anyway! Since he signed his most recent contract, he’s played 6 games. If we hadn’t rushed in with an unnecessary contract, we would have had much more flexibility.
Michael Shenton - giving any player a three year contract that doesn’t end until he is 36 is just ridiculous. He deserved to continue his career at the time he signed his contract, but we should have learnt from Andy Lynch how quickly excellent players can deteriorate with age. Three years was just stupid.
Unfortunately, retentions and recruitment go hand-in-hand. In a salary-capped sport, retaining a player has a direct impact on a club’s ability to recruit new ones. We’ve tied our hands by giving long contracts to players who quite frankly hadn’t earned them.
Spot on that mate 👍

braytontiger
Michael Eagar
Posts: 4918
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2006 9:17 am

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by braytontiger » Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:30 am

nottinghamtiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:37 am
tigerfeat wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:17 am
I agree to a certain extent but most people thought matautia was a good signing most people thought Blair was a good signing most people agreed it was correct to extend the contracts of the likes of Eden Mcshane Milner Massey and co after 2017 Wardle was playing well in the Nrl
I don't think Wells is the right man in place I've said that before but it's only fair to point out it's easy to be wise after the event
I agree to some extent. My issue has been retention rather than recruitment, and the length of contracts that we gave average or injury-prone players.
James Clare had his contract extended after only playing nine game. Why did we give him a two-year deal to the end of 2021 after only nine games?
Ollie Holmes got a contract extension in early 2018 that takes him to the end of 2021. He had only played 14 games in 2016 and 11 games in 2017. It was madness to give a player who had played so few games such a long contract, and no surprise he’s barely played this year.
Alex Foster - where do we start? He signed a two year contract in 2017 that took him to the end of 2019. For some bizarre reason, we then gave him another contract in 2018, even though he still had over eighteen months on his current deal! Why? We’ve given him a deal to the end of 2021 after such a short time at the club, and when he was under contract anyway! Since he signed his most recent contract, he’s played 6 games. If we hadn’t rushed in with an unnecessary contract, we would have had much more flexibility.
Michael Shenton - giving any player a three year contract that doesn’t end until he is 36 is just ridiculous. He deserved to continue his career at the time he signed his contract, but we should have learnt from Andy Lynch how quickly excellent players can deteriorate with age. Three years was just stupid.
Unfortunately, retentions and recruitment go hand-in-hand. In a salary-capped sport, retaining a player has a direct impact on a club’s ability to recruit new ones. We’ve tied our hands by giving long contracts to players who quite frankly hadn’t earned them.
You can only assume that the agent Craig Harrison could sell ice to the eskimos or we are unbelievably gullible or both.

nottinghamtiger
Luke Gale
Posts: 3382
Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:17 pm

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by nottinghamtiger » Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:51 am

braytontiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:30 am
nottinghamtiger wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:37 am
tigerfeat wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:17 am
I agree to a certain extent but most people thought matautia was a good signing most people thought Blair was a good signing most people agreed it was correct to extend the contracts of the likes of Eden Mcshane Milner Massey and co after 2017 Wardle was playing well in the Nrl
I don't think Wells is the right man in place I've said that before but it's only fair to point out it's easy to be wise after the event
I agree to some extent. My issue has been retention rather than recruitment, and the length of contracts that we gave average or injury-prone players.
James Clare had his contract extended after only playing nine game. Why did we give him a two-year deal to the end of 2021 after only nine games?
Ollie Holmes got a contract extension in early 2018 that takes him to the end of 2021. He had only played 14 games in 2016 and 11 games in 2017. It was madness to give a player who had played so few games such a long contract, and no surprise he’s barely played this year.
Alex Foster - where do we start? He signed a two year contract in 2017 that took him to the end of 2019. For some bizarre reason, we then gave him another contract in 2018, even though he still had over eighteen months on his current deal! Why? We’ve given him a deal to the end of 2021 after such a short time at the club, and when he was under contract anyway! Since he signed his most recent contract, he’s played 6 games. If we hadn’t rushed in with an unnecessary contract, we would have had much more flexibility.
Michael Shenton - giving any player a three year contract that doesn’t end until he is 36 is just ridiculous. He deserved to continue his career at the time he signed his contract, but we should have learnt from Andy Lynch how quickly excellent players can deteriorate with age. Three years was just stupid.
Unfortunately, retentions and recruitment go hand-in-hand. In a salary-capped sport, retaining a player has a direct impact on a club’s ability to recruit new ones. We’ve tied our hands by giving long contracts to players who quite frankly hadn’t earned them.
You can only assume that the agent Craig Harrison could sell ice to the eskimos or we are unbelievably gullible or both.
Well it doesn't happen at other clubs, so I'm going with 'unbelievably gullible'.

HuddsTigers
Malcolm Reilly
Posts: 15203
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:55 am

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by HuddsTigers » Fri Oct 04, 2019 12:48 pm

Shenton's contract ends at the end of 2021 so he'll be 35, not 36. The problem that we have is that we don't know the detail of what his (or anyone's) salary will be for the final years, or indeed what terms if it is based on (e.g. it could be that it's more of an off-field role in 2021 and a squad back-up player when needed).

When you look at others it does look slightly bizarre. The more I hear/see of Craig Harrison and the general influence he has in the game, I do wonder how much of an effect he has in terms of making the club panic thinking they're going to lose their best players. I wonder if we're seen as a stepping stone club by him for his players.

Let's not forget, he himself said in the summer that Gale would be at Cas next season. There's no doubting he's a good agent and advocate of the game. But I think we need to grow some spine and start standing up to him a bit.
In the spirit of the final Blackadder episode - Goooodbyeee!

tigerfeat
Dale Fritz
Posts: 7459
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:07 pm

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by tigerfeat » Fri Oct 04, 2019 1:01 pm

the fact hes Powells agent as well may have a bearing on things it may not...but Wells should be taking no crap off him the bloke would shaft the club without thinking about it if it suited him
The measure of who we are is what we do with what we have
Vince Lombardi

nottinghamtiger
Luke Gale
Posts: 3382
Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2006 4:17 pm

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by nottinghamtiger » Fri Oct 04, 2019 1:11 pm

HuddsTigers wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 12:48 pm
Shenton's contract ends at the end of 2021 so he'll be 35, not 36. The problem that we have is that we don't know the detail of what his (or anyone's) salary will be for the final years, or indeed what terms if it is based on (e.g. it could be that it's more of an off-field role in 2021 and a squad back-up player when needed.
35/36. It's equally as ridiculous.
I guess we don't know the value of any contract, let alone for each year. But it does't change the fact that that a player won't be playing for nothing, so therefore take up a proportion of the salary cap that could be used for recruitment.
The fact is we've given long-term contracts to players who either haven't proven themselves on the field (eg Clare), have barely played due to injury (eg Holmes), are too old to warrant the length of contract they have been given (Shenton) or who had recently signed a deal that just didn't need renewing (Foster).
And now seems an apt time to mention Jamie Ellis. A three year contract for a player who wasn't wanted by his current club, and who sent him on loan to a Championship team even though they only had one other half back, was another example of tying our hands. I was willing to go with the club signing him, but not for three years! You won't find another example of a Super League club giving an unwanted Championship player a three-year contract.

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jackknife
Luke Gale
Posts: 3410
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 5:28 pm
Location: york

Re: 2020 Squad

Post by jackknife » Fri Oct 04, 2019 1:25 pm

Rankin
Feki
Blair
Shenton / Mata’utia
Eden
Trueman
Richardson
Watts
Mcshane
Smith
Holmes
McMeeken
Massey

Milner
Millington
Moors
Jsl

That would be my strongest 17 but i would change players regularly to keep everyone fresh
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CLASSY CAS FOREVER

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