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Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 10 Feb 2021, 13:30
by FIat Capper
In turn, as I said, in or out of the EU we will still be obliged to deal with the poor souls that find themselves lost in what you claim are British waters. Being inside or outside of the EU won't change this at all unless everyone deals with the problem at source (which is not France). I'm also guessing you're not aware of the multi-cultural life in many parts of France which has a long record of housing immigrants?

I am pleased we are ahead of the EU with vaccines but over 100k dead doesn't seem like a price worth paying for putting all our eggs in the vaccine basket. I assume being out of the EU didn't stop us developing a better Covid strategy? Thanks Bozza - not!

Trade deals, again, robbing Peter to pay Paul is not a good economic policy. We've lost a huge market in the EU and whilst CANZUK and others may offer alternatives, I have no faith in being able to obtain fair trade deals that give us a net benefit. They may well open us up to cheaper imports that ultimately cost jobs and the economy.

Canada may well be 'developing' but climate change is likely to limit the expansion somewhat. I for one do not want to see the destruction of the Northern forests in the same way the Amazon has. It is after all far easier to share energy provision over the 20 miles of the English channel than it is over the 3k miles of the Atlantic.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 10 Feb 2021, 17:36
by Tigers1926
Capper, the pork situation will sort itself out by simply breeding enough for the demand. As for immigration, the EU as turned the biggest of blind eyes over the years in that the UK will have em. Eg what have the EU done about Hungary? Besides all of this the immigrants once landed in the EU are in safe hands and they should be equally distributed throughout the EU and not just the UK. The other big players in the EU should hang their heads in shame. As for the vaccines don't get me started. They have been caught asleep or is it possible that the other major EU countries don't want to have to pay for the countries that cannot afford it now that one of its biggest paymasters has left the corrupt party. Talk about childish and bottom lip out, and all they can do is threaten NI, pathetic! Back to immigration for a minute, it should have immediately stopped once we left and infact we should be deporting any EU nationals on benefits, and should be one for one, ie one polish in for every British citizen who goes to work in Poland and so on with all other EU countries. People are going to say we can't manage without em, wrong, it's the companies who thought they could get away with paying higher wages for the UK workforce. We only joined the common market in the 70s and look how it ended! The big players in the EU seem to have very short memories of what this little island did in both the world wars and we still ended up being forced to accept all their corrupt closed shop laws and rrules.Sure we can trade with them if they want to, but for every way they wish to do us over, its gotta be reciprocated. It's about time us British stood up and be proud of ourselves cos in the EU we couldn't for fear of being branded racist πŸ‡¬πŸ‡§ ps Just a little note on what most of the immigrants are who are in France waiting to get here, they are young Islamic males who put British truck drivers at risk every day, I should know, it's what I do πŸš›

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 10 Feb 2021, 17:43
by Tigers1926
Should be lower wages πŸ‘

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 10 Feb 2021, 18:31
by FIat Capper
I'm sure the average Pork farmer will be happy to survive on selling one pig per year. The EU market is there and we, yes we, have but an unnecessary barrier between us. Demand goes down, British farmers suffer.

I'm also unsure what you don't understand about the refugees that are so desperate for a better safer life they risk climbing in your wagon for that risk free ride over here. They will still try, come what may.

As for the Eastern Europeans, it would appear our new deal with Canada, Aus and NZ will be free to enter with no control, replacing the Poles. |I doubt they'll come for the lesser paid jobs though as all those countries pay better because of their economic base. Once again our farmers will suffer because no one will want to pick fruit and veg.

The world markets were always there and British manufacturing is still renowned around the world for it's quality, based on higher skill sets.

I am proud of the fact I'm British but feel no need to shout about it. I was happy to let our inclusive actions far outweigh the shouting and balling of the likes of Farage.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 10 Feb 2021, 19:09
by Tigers1926
They are young men who hide down motorway bankings after they have thrown bricks and slabs on the road so you have to swerve or stop and when you do, they assault us and call us infidels and have weapons, knives etc, and they wonder why we don't want to stop. The French police do not want to know. I understand the families who want to reach safe shores but it must be 95% are men who you would not want in your town.. We have to have our breaks before or around Paris so as we don't have to stop again before the channel tunnel, Calais or Dunkerque.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 10 Feb 2021, 20:38
by CasRus
Capper, it wouldn't be so bad if genuine people want to come over to relocate due to persecution which some are, however a high number of these illegals are young blokes who are coming to get on the land of milk and honey pan-crack with free housing and a significant number of these will go on to lead a life of crime. I for one do not want these "low lifes" on my doorstep and I'm sure you don't either. Just look at the number of murders of our population at the hands of some of these illegals who entered our country that we have suffered in the last few years - plenty to choose from !

People seeking sanctuary need to go through the right channels rather than jump on an inflatable dingy and be then vetted properly as we don't want anyone who really cannot contribute to society and be prepared to work for a decent living. After all, it all comes from your and my tax payments and I would rather have that money spent on the NHS and other needs instead of having to belly up to support non contributors. The other aspect is that if we are getting a 10 year in jail sentence imposed for lying our way back into the UK from holiday, why are we allowing illegals who we don't know and who may have a south african covid variant be picked up mid channel and expose our rescue service personnel and cause a spread and kill a few thousand more innocent people ?? Risky or what !!!

On low paid work where we need workers from the EU, just don't make me laugh as we already have plenty of idle arsed people who could do the work but would rather lard arse around drinking and fagging all day in the pub on their state donated "pancrack provided" money and leave their kids to fend for themselves and let them lead a life of crime to better themselves - we all have seen this and you can't tell me any different !

Gone are the days where kids would get stuck in to earn a legitimate amount of money albeit meagre with small task jobs around the area. Kids of today are now more likely to be drug runners in most urban areas to earn a crust as discipline in schools and at home has all but disappeared !

Sorry this sounds draconian, however we need to grow a pair to deal with all these considered wrongs as we just cannot afford to allow illegals on all sorts of levels and should shepherd them back into French waters from whence they came being a continent of equal and first port of call sanctuary !! We should also remove payments from whoever turns down job opportunities when out of work - We've always been too soft and That's my opinion !

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 10 Feb 2021, 20:59
by Tigers1926
Your not wrong CasRus. We've only got the eastern europeans because our lazy tw*ts can't be arsed. Let's deal with our own issues first, and stop the benefits. The French navy escort the dinghys to English waters knowing the British navy can't go into French waters to prevent em coming, so the French are as much the problem. You've only got to go back to last year when that Syrian immigrant stabbed 3 British men in the park in Reading, SHOCKING. People need to wake up to what is happening every day.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 11 Feb 2021, 13:31
by FIat Capper
It seems I've popped onto the Daily Mail's website of misinformation and exaggeration!

On immigrants, yes there are some that are chancing their arm but there are also many that are desperate. I for one do not consider crossing the the channel in an overcrowded dingy an exercise worth taking unless I really needed to.

Neither do any of these automatically receive a free house or benefits. They go through a system.

More importantly, being in or out of the EU WILL NOT STOP THEM COMING!

As for them all being murderers and rapists. Laws of probability suggest some will be of this ilk, just like it is in the population that is already here. should I assume this blanket ban on immigrants will include and equally sadistic ban on emigration. After all, we don't want the chance one of the many hundreds of British murderers making it to another country to escape do we? (Sutcliffe, Robert Black, Denis Nielson, Black Panther, Brady and Hindley, Beverley Allit, Shipman and hundreds more)

And you claim it is I that needs to smell the coffee.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 11 Feb 2021, 14:00
by CasRus
FIat Capper wrote: ↑11 Feb 2021, 13:31 It seems I've popped onto the Daily Mail's website of misinformation and exaggeration!

On immigrants, yes there are some that are chancing their arm but there are also many that are desperate. I for one do not consider crossing the the channel in an overcrowded dingy an exercise worth taking unless I really needed to.

Neither do any of these automatically receive a free house or benefits. They go through a system.

More importantly, being in or out of the EU WILL NOT STOP THEM COMING!

As for them all being murderers and rapists. Laws of probability suggest some will be of this ilk, just like it is in the population that is already here. should I assume this blanket ban on immigrants will include and equally sadistic ban on emigration. After all, we don't want the chance one of the many hundreds of British murderers making it to another country to escape do we? (Sutcliffe, Robert Black, Denis Nielson, Black Panther, Brady and Hindley, Beverley Allit, Shipman and hundreds more)

And you claim it is I that needs to smell the coffee.
Nice try Capper but falls way short of your intellectual standard !

We don't have hundreds of British murderers and as you have pointed out, most of these are known and are locked up who are still alive and how do you expect them to escape from a British Jail ???? Your argument is oh so nonsensical !!

What we have coming here is people of unknown origin and beliefs and what has been quite rightly pointed out by Tiger who is in on this discussion, we have already suffered killings by these Isis Fanatics in both London and Manchester as prime examples !! You try explaining your position on this to the many family members who have lost loved ones in Machete and Bomb Attacks killing people in their prime of life.

Your Quote - "I for one do not consider crossing the the channel in an overcrowded dingy an exercise worth taking unless I really needed to" - Well let's take that statement at face value shall we and, in theory, say I am a devout believer and a trained armed terrorist intent of causing destruction to the Infidel West based on my Isis beliefs, then yes it really would be an exercise worth taking and be needed to in jumping into an overcrowded dingy while muttering "Allah OO Akbah" to give me strength !!
YOUR ARGUMENT FALLS DOWN HERE UNFORTUNATELY !! I think you do now need to put the Coffee Pot on and start sniffing !!

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 11 Feb 2021, 14:40
by FIat Capper
Absolutely ludicrous. The fact you cannot understand my arguments doesn't mean it falls down.

Dismissing the possibility of there being hundreds of British murderers enhances you lack of understand. Over the centuries there's been thousands.

If it helps, my reference to British murderers relates to the fact that because we have them shouldn't mean we cannot emigrate. After all, we only became aware of them after they'd committed their crimes and as such, anyone of a similar ilk that emigrates will also be unknown until they are caught.

Similarly, the fact a miniscule number of those coming to this country may become law breakers shouldn't mean we close our doors. Indeed, many of the fundamentalists are already here, born and bred.

I'd also be very, very angry if anyone I care about was a victim of Shipman (hundreds of victims) or any of the others mentioned. I cannot imagine how difficult it is to deal with such an act by anyone.

For those few fundamentalists that do try to get here illegally, as their primary aim is to take out as many 'infidels' as possible, there's not much point falling overboard on the way. They tend to take less obvious routes, hiding in plain sight so to speak.

I'm still drinking water...

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 11 Feb 2021, 14:42
by FIat Capper
And for the umpteenth time, Brexit has not and will not stop attempts to cross the channel so it hasn't helped one bit has it.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 11 Feb 2021, 16:19
by CasRus
FIat Capper wrote: ↑11 Feb 2021, 14:42 And for the umpteenth time, Brexit has not and will not stop attempts to cross the channel so it hasn't helped one bit has it.
Oops ! looks like I touched a raw nerve !

Brexit hasn't had enough chance to get going after only 6 weeks so if and when our laws are changed and the rules are illegally and immediate deport return back out, there will be a vast reduction of people trying to illegally enter - that is pure and simple rocket science !!

I don't dispute that genuine people are escaping persecution, but these need to be means tested properly by stringent methods and which need to be introduced and devised by fair process.

On your other responses, you are totally wrong on several levels and I do not need to repeat myself as to why which I have already demonstrated, rather, your latest comments I believe are still a very weak attempt and do not overcome the positional argument I have tabled.

I suggest you start emptying your glass of water and try Gin !! It might make you smile a little !!

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 11 Feb 2021, 16:55
by Tigers1926
I would suggest that any British murderers who want to travel/emigrate will have their history/criminal record go beforehand, whereas these who risk it in a dinghy are trying to mingle in, knowing that when they land in Kent they will be met by paramedics to check em out, police to try and get some information from the individuals which they are really going to be up front about, before they are fed and put on a coach to be spread around the country in nice hotels paid for by guess who! Will they have had their criminal record checked out? mmmmm πŸ€” but like I said in a previous post, the French are escorting them to the edge of French waters! Not good enough really when they have already travelled through France.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 11 Feb 2021, 17:10
by Tigers1926
Oh, and just for good measure, this has been happening every single day since covid started.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 12 Feb 2021, 13:56
by FIat Capper
Tigers1926 wrote: ↑11 Feb 2021, 16:55 I would suggest that any British murderers who want to travel/emigrate will have their history/criminal record go beforehand, whereas these who risk it in a dinghy are trying to mingle in, knowing that when they land in Kent they will be met by paramedics to check em out, police to try and get some information from the individuals which they are really going to be up front about, before they are fed and put on a coach to be spread around the country in nice hotels paid for by guess who! Will they have had their criminal record checked out? mmmmm πŸ€” but like I said in a previous post, the French are escorting them to the edge of French waters! Not good enough really when they have already travelled through France.
We only know about the convicted murderers, I'm talking about the potential for these folk to emigrate prior to being caught but still capable of hennas crimes. Just like the very tiny few you are talking about coming here.

And the French have upped patrol along their beaches but the criminal underworld that organises these sight-seeing tours know full well how to avoid the authorities. Once they've made it to our shores they are sent to detention centres to be assessed and once we are satisfied they can be released into the community, they do so.

It is also widely acknowledged that prior to Brexit, the net benefits of immigration work far more in our favour than to the detriment. However, only time will tell what the impact will be now that we've cut off our island from the Eastern Europeans that greatly added to our economy.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 12 Feb 2021, 15:33
by CasRus
FIat Capper wrote: ↑12 Feb 2021, 13:56
Tigers1926 wrote: ↑11 Feb 2021, 16:55 I would suggest that any British murderers who want to travel/emigrate will have their history/criminal record go beforehand, whereas these who risk it in a dinghy are trying to mingle in, knowing that when they land in Kent they will be met by paramedics to check em out, police to try and get some information from the individuals which they are really going to be up front about, before they are fed and put on a coach to be spread around the country in nice hotels paid for by guess who! Will they have had their criminal record checked out? mmmmm πŸ€” but like I said in a previous post, the French are escorting them to the edge of French waters! Not good enough really when they have already travelled through France.
We only know about the convicted murderers, I'm talking about the potential for these folk to emigrate prior to being caught but still capable of hennas crimes. Just like the very tiny few you are talking about coming here.

And the French have upped patrol along their beaches but the criminal underworld that organises these sight-seeing tours know full well how to avoid the authorities. Once they've made it to our shores they are sent to detention centres to be assessed and once we are satisfied they can be released into the community, they do so.

It is also widely acknowledged that prior to Brexit, the net benefits of immigration work far more in our favour than to the detriment. However, only time will tell what the impact will be now that we've cut off our island from the Eastern Europeans that greatly added to our economy.
Capper, you are starting to make me laugh at your naive shortcomings and outlook !

How many murderers do you think are walking about the UK who are still free - it's probably a handful at best !

How many Isis members are most likely to be sat in France awaiting their opportunity to get into the UK ? I bet it's 10 fold more than what murderers who are still walking free around the UK !! Also, these Isis members have been highly trained in the Middle East and have wilful intent to murder as many as possible with bomb making as a skill set example (remember London and Manchester Arena), whereas a murderer here is looking for a one hit opportunity. THERE IS NO COMPARISON - you have your head stuck somewhere oblivious !! The risk to the UK is enormous in comparison. Also, how do you think our detention centres are going to weedle out these people who they don't have any intel on ??? It's nigh on impossible !!

On Immigration work, just let me repeat it one more time for you as it seems it ain't sinking in ! We have a sizeable set of people who are content to lard arse their way through life costing the taxpayer oodles of money when they could be replacing these Eastern Europeans who take up valuable and hard to come by housing, send most of their money back to their motherland and also have the audacity to claim child benefit money and also send back for their children back home !! Our Lard Arse work shy contingent could negate all of this need for imported labour and the money saved in pancrack payments would at least provide more money for badly needed projects here in the UK like more Hospitals, better roads etc !!! GET REAL WILL YOU - IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE !!!

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 12 Feb 2021, 17:16
by alftupper
FIat Capper wrote: ↑12 Feb 2021, 13:56
It is also widely acknowledged that prior to Brexit, the net benefits of immigration work far more in our favour than to the detriment.
You are talking in terms of economic prosperity and off course the likes of the CBI would love more and more cheap Labour to wash up on shore. Brexiteers have said all along it’s not all about the money. It’s quite normal now to be stood in a supermarket queue and not be able to have a chat about the weather because the line consists of non English speakers jabbering in tongues. Non English speaking ghettos springing up all over the place. As for the economic migrants and that is what they are from the Middle East, do we really need to be inflating the proportion of our population who live their lives by a medieval religious culture. I don’t want them here, we have spent millions on setting up safe camps for these people in their own lands they should stay there and help rebuild their society.

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 12 Feb 2021, 17:18
by FIat Capper
My head is only stuck in periodicals and online, reading facts about all these situations - facts you and your lot choose to ignore.

For the number of Isis supporters coming over there are 10 fold already here, born and bred. Security services do an outstanding job trying to keep an eye on them. It's similar to the terrors brought about during the Northern Irish situation in the 70's/80's but we didn't ban the Irish from coming over did we?

The fact that a miniscule number may come over with the intent to harm doesn't justify closing our borders to one and all, otherwise there'd be no international travel.

On immigration as whole and as I keep saying, prior to Brexit, free movement benefitted the British economy, it made us money. Yes there are some that choose not to work but not enough to fill the void and certainly not enough with the required skills. I do however, support Gov't spending to improve training and education to give everyone the chance to shine. I's like training dogs, if you keep beating them they simply refuse to respond positively. Adequate rewards are the way forward.

It's not even basic math's let alone rocket science...

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 12 Feb 2021, 17:19
by FIat Capper
alftupper wrote: ↑12 Feb 2021, 17:16
FIat Capper wrote: ↑12 Feb 2021, 13:56
It is also widely acknowledged that prior to Brexit, the net benefits of immigration work far more in our favour than to the detriment.
You are talking in terms of economic prosperity and off course the likes of the CBI would love more and more cheap Labour to wash up on shore. Brexiteers have said all along it’s not all about the money. It’s quite normal now to be stood in a supermarket queue and not be able to have a chat about the weather because the line consists of non English speakers jabbering in tongues. Non English speaking ghettos springing up all over the place. As for the economic migrants and that is what they are from the Middle East, do we really need to be inflating the proportion of our population who live their lives by a medieval religious culture. I don’t want them here, we have spent millions on setting up safe camps for these people in their own lands they should stay there and help rebuild their society.
Why not chuck racism in as well...

Re: BREXIT - Good or Bad ??

Posted: 12 Feb 2021, 18:26
by Tigers1926
Who you calling racist FC? This is what a lot of lefties don't understand and call concern, racism. As for the minuscule who come here to murder in the name of my God is better than your God, I think you'll find it is a massive percentage per head. They put them straight on coaches at Dover and they are taken all over the UK to hotels, eg the hotel at whitwood, the nice one at the side of the M1 at wakefield etc. They are not checked for covid, they just make the driver wear a mask. Would you drive a coach full of young Islamic men? No, me neither. I have enough dealings with these at Calais or Dunkerque or whichever port I'm booked to sail from, and a lot are carrying knives. The EU doesn't really give a toss and never really have because it's "oh Britain will have em" I blame the companies for employing them for less money and the government for letting our lazy buggers get away with it. Now we have left the EU, we should be able to accept or reject whoever we like and not have to answer to anyone. Like I said previously, these European countries seem to have short memories, otherwise they would be speaking German..