Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by casjunction » 18 Apr 2020, 12:01

HS2 has been a farce from start to finish.
Oh it's not even started,
If you want a Northern powerhouse a train capable of going a few miles an hour fastef than Mallard providing commuters with "fast" travel to the capital is not the answer.
Corvid 19 has shown many functions can be carried out from home but not manufacturing.
The money would be far better invested in green technologies, manufacturing, education and health.
If it goes ahead the real winners will be the investors.
As by the time it is completed it will be even more obsolescent than it is already.
Take Care
Stay Safe

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by alftupper » 18 Apr 2020, 14:23

Flat Capper wrote: 18 Apr 2020, 11:00
baldtiger wrote: 16 Apr 2020, 18:23
alftupper wrote: 15 Apr 2020, 21:17
alftupper wrote: 02 Apr 2020, 17:16 anybody think HS2 will still be going ahead?
Confirmed today that they are pressing ahead with it
I never did support it, I think its the biggest waste of money in 2009 costs were estimated at 37.5 billion now they recon 106 billion thats 307 million pounds per mile ! chuffing mental :roll:
I can see the HS2 project being the [very expensive] 'token' gesture to the North to back up BJ's promises from the election campaign. sadly, the situation has changed and IMO the gov't will need to look at alternative measures for the North that aren'y quitre as expensiveas HS2 or provide a more efficient use of the same amount of dosh though spreading the money across a greater number of 'smaller' projects.

Investment will still be required to get te economy moving again.
Oh dear, Crapper once again fails to grasp the facts and shows himself up when attempting to score a political point. Maybe he needs to be reminded that HS2 was a Labour idea and the lovechild of champagne socialist Andrew Adonis.

I can see the HS2 project being the [very expensive] 'token' gesture to the North to back up BJ's promises

How so, when every report into the benefits show that London will be the greatest winner, northerners do not view it as a benefit to them, so explain why it will be a token gesture to the North.

the situation has changed and IMO the gov't will need to look at alternative measures for the North that aren'y quitre as expensiveas HS2

keep up, it was announced this week that construction was to proceed.

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasRus » 18 Apr 2020, 14:59

casjunction wrote: 18 Apr 2020, 12:01 HS2 has been a farce from start to finish.
Oh it's not even started,
If you want a Northern powerhouse a train capable of going a few miles an hour fastef than Mallard providing commuters with "fast" travel to the capital is not the answer.
Corvid 19 has shown many functions can be carried out from home but not manufacturing.
The money would be far better invested in green technologies, manufacturing, education and health.
If it goes ahead the real winners will be the investors.
As by the time it is completed it will be even more obsolescent than it is already.
Take Care
Stay Safe
I'm of the opinion that you are most probably now right due to the economic catastrophe about to be played out, however I just think it is more of a take on Global Issues than just considering domestically.

The overriding factor which I base my thoughts on is in just one word and that is "China" - We have been asleep for too many years to not see the fact that most of the world in importing cheaper cost goods from China has made them very powerful and the fact is that they are now holding all the aces ! There seems to be something very sinister in the fact that the virus allegedly started from Wuhan and their major cities of Bejing and Shanghai that lay close to Wuhan have not got any extreme incidence of Covid when the rest of the world's capitals thousands of miles away are under lockdown with many deaths !!! How can that be !!! Something smells VERY BAD here !!!

I always remember a very intelligent tutor at Whitwood Tech telling me over 47 years ago while I was an apprentice there that China would try to take over the world eventually and that they were keeping low key until factors were right to make that attempt ! I just now wonder if this is that attempt with biological warfare while they are and have the strongest economy in the world and have the likes of Africa supplying them raw materials when Africa are in massive debt to them and all the while that the South China Sea is being taken over by man made islands that they keep building and putting massive military installations on and are likely to be in pole position to take the likes of Japan, Phillipines and Malaysia out very quickly and then on to Oz !

We have all been had by China and Western civilisation really need to wake up to these facts and start setting up manufacturing bases to make what we need within the west rather than the reliance of importing from China and stop this madness ! The only question here is "Are we too late" ! as the famous song goes "There May Be Trouble Ahead" !!

So, in answer to domestic issues Cas Junction, in my opinion yes I think you are right and HS2 needs to and can wait till later and Manufacturing Industry needs to be prioritised with emphasis on jobs as indications are that we are about to be losing 3-4 million jobs within this coming year and which also then starts to negate reliance on China in the future - Note we will all also have to consider living more frugally from all this as "wages" v "cost of living" will not ever be the same again as we have had before this crisis.

Just one other thought on this that is a positive (however which goes against the grain of the death rate and mess we are in) - The environment/nature is getting a well earned rest which is a major plus for the planet - This was also making me wonder whether the Top Environment scientists had flagged up that we are dangerously close to a tipping point of no return with an extinction event on the horizon with all the fires and floods recently and whether this Covid has been released to slow down the growth of population and more pollution with the blessing of the "POWERS THAT BE" - It's an interesting theory and one to ponder on !

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by Flat Capper » 18 Apr 2020, 15:10

alftupper wrote: 18 Apr 2020, 14:23
Oh dear, Crapper once again fails to grasp the facts and shows himself up when attempting to score a political point. Maybe he needs to be reminded that HS2 was a Labour idea and the lovechild of champagne socialist Andrew Adonis.

I can see the HS2 project being the [very expensive] 'token' gesture to the North to back up BJ's promises

How so, when every report into the benefits show that London will be the greatest winner, northerners do not view it as a benefit to them, so explain why it will be a token gesture to the North.

the situation has changed and IMO the gov't will need to look at alternative measures for the North that aren'y quitre as expensiveas HS2

keep up, it was announced this week that construction was to proceed.
[/quote]

Oh dear, once again Alfie fails to see the nose in front of his face that he regularly falls flat on!

I assume that, like they have with so many Labour ideas and policies, the current government has the power to change the Labour actions? In which case, any decsion to continue is made by THIS Tory government and cannot be blamed on Labour, you idiot.

I do not support HS2, partly because I know it won't really benefit the North but will in fact further move people and investment to the South. However, I still believe Boris and his cronies will claim it benefits the North and will use it as their evidence of supporting the North.

I know they're continuing with it. I've given my thoughts on why I think they are doing so.

Think you need to get some help Alfie
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasRus » 22 Apr 2020, 09:52

Guys, I've been using this topic on occasion in discussion to point out and convey a number of world catastrophe occurrences on the horizon and as to why the world is about to have a come-uppence from various directions be it melting polar caps, fires around the world, flooding, China/Pandemic and the snowball effect that will speed up processes.

Well here's a newly released press statement from the UN and which will have repercussions for the whole of humanity if this cannot be dealt with and it is looking very grave and is not a million miles away of currently happening :-

----------------------------------------------------------------------

UNITED NATIONS (AP) — The head of the U.N. food agency warned Tuesday that, as the world is dealing with the coronavirus pandemic, it is also “on the brink of a hunger pandemic” that could lead to “multiple famines of biblical proportions” within a few months if immediate action isn’t taken.
World Food Program Executive Director David Beasley told the U.N. Security Council that even before COVID-19 became an issue, he was telling world leaders that “2020 would be facing the worst humanitarian crisis since World War II.” That’s because of wars in Syria, Yemen and elsewhere, locust swarms in Africa, frequent natural disasters and economic crises including in Lebanon, Congo, Sudan and Ethiopia, he said.
Beasley said today 821 million people go to bed hungry every night all over the world, a further 135 million people are facing “crisis levels of hunger or worse,” and a new World Food Program analysis shows that as a result of COVID-19 an additional 130 million people “could be pushed to the brink of starvation by the end of 2020.”

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Sorry to keep sounding like the "Angel of Doom" but you need to be very aware of these issues as it will have a definite effect on all of us either directly or indirectly.

Stay Safe and try to be prepared ………………….if we and you can !!!!!!!!!!

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by Flat Capper » 22 Apr 2020, 11:07

Firstly, what I'm about to say is not dismissing what you're saying, I think it's inevitable and was always going to happen with or without a pandemic. We've over-exploiteds this planet since we learned to light fires.

However, I take the view that it's not worth worrying about, we all die in the end and ultimately, the planet with be consumed by the sun one day. Nature has always controlled animal populations and we are but an animal.
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasRus » 22 Apr 2020, 12:44

Flat Capper wrote: 22 Apr 2020, 11:07 Firstly, what I'm about to say is not dismissing what you're saying, I think it's inevitable and was always going to happen with or without a pandemic. We've over-exploiteds this planet since we learned to light fires.

However, I take the view that it's not worth worrying about, we all die in the end and ultimately, the planet with be consumed by the sun one day. Nature has always controlled animal populations and we are but an animal.
Quite Correct Capper (that's the best opinion you have actually made for a few months ….ha ha - only joking !)

There is absolutely No Point in you worrying or anyone worrying for that matter as death is an inevitability we all have to face ! - Once dead, what's gone before does not then matter at all to any of us !

Life is a very strange concept and to reason why we stay alive for a number of years only to die off makes you think what life is all about anyway when it then doesn't matter to anyone at all once we are all dead ! Sorry for sounding a bit Philosophical but it's all a bit weird of why we are all here and what purpose it actually serves in the grand scheme of things !!

It only really matters while we are indeed alive in the here and now, so stay safe, protect yourself, keep an eye on what is going on in the world and we all need to consider collectively taking the action in a combined method in providing assistance and help to our friends and neighbours in looking after each other where possible to overcome and get through what is looking like a world degradation of massive proportions ! If we don't work together to do this in helping each other when food shortages potentially start to happen, it will become a survival of the fittest and that is where law and order will start to break down !

Interesting Times we live in which will test the character of everyone ! Hopefully, if and when we get through this, as everyone already seems to know, that life and living will be very different and hopefully for the better for the younger generation ! It does make you wonder if all this is or was designer planned and needed for nature to survive as pollution levels have significantly dropped and wildlife is starting to recover - Every Silver Lining eh but a very sad and devastating outcome for bereaved family members with all the deaths ongoing by this virus !!

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by casjunction » 22 Apr 2020, 14:42

Some wise words!
As you have said the challenge is far greater than ever.
The answer if there is one will not be achieved without cooperation and consideration.
It's time for collective working and honesty not point scoring.
Showing appreciation of the NHS and keyworkers is commendable but tbere are still many flouting the rules ir guidelines.
Their lack of consideration far out weighs the sentiment of applause.
The discord between politicians is being to show.
They still seem to lie to score points.
The issue of the PPE from Turkey being a prime example.
When this pandemic hits the third world which lack basic hygiene and so on the impact on food production could be massive.
My vein hope is this terrible situation makes us a wiser species and we appreciate the value of ordinary people more and the so called stars of whatever arena sport, music and so on realise that we can manage better without them than the person who empties our bins or the people who harvest the crops.
Take care, be kind and lets all try to become better people as a result of this terrible situation.

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by alftupper » 22 Apr 2020, 16:08

Flat Capper wrote: 22 Apr 2020, 11:07 Firstly, what I'm about to say is not dismissing what you're saying, I think it's inevitable and was always going to happen with or without a pandemic. We've over-exploiteds this planet since we learned to light fires.

However, I take the view that it's not worth worrying about, we all die in the end and ultimately, the planet with be consumed by the sun one day. Nature has always controlled animal populations and we are but an animal.
I suppose it had to happen someday but I totally agree with Crapper here. I’m completely relaxed about climate change and mass extinction. How human beings have conducted themselves during their short existence makes their potential extinction all the more appealing.
It is estimated that 99% of all species that have ever existed on Earth are extinct so no need to panic about the Giant Panda or Blue Whale being wiped out. Who knows in a million years time or so a completely new species may hold sway which can do a far better job.

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasRus » 22 Apr 2020, 18:48

alftupper wrote: 22 Apr 2020, 16:08
Flat Capper wrote: 22 Apr 2020, 11:07 Firstly, what I'm about to say is not dismissing what you're saying, I think it's inevitable and was always going to happen with or without a pandemic. We've over-exploiteds this planet since we learned to light fires.

However, I take the view that it's not worth worrying about, we all die in the end and ultimately, the planet with be consumed by the sun one day. Nature has always controlled animal populations and we are but an animal.
I suppose it had to happen someday but I totally agree with Crapper here. I’m completely relaxed about climate change and mass extinction. How human beings have conducted themselves during their short existence makes their potential extinction all the more appealing.
It is estimated that 99% of all species that have ever existed on Earth are extinct so no need to panic about the Giant Panda or Blue Whale being wiped out. Who knows in a million years time or so a completely new species may hold sway which can do a far better job.
Careful Alf, agreeing with Capper ! Don't be seduced by the Dark Side ! ...………….Ha Ha !!

Yes the world is definitely at a crossroads and this can go either way !

This will be the acid test as to whether we as a species can organize ourselves out of this with common sense "work together" application or finish up battering each other to death ! It will also prove as to whether we are intelligent enough to continue or, ultimately never learn and finish up destroying ourselves which would go to show that we aren't an intelligent life form at all that is worthy of survival !

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by Flat Capper » 22 Apr 2020, 23:04

Don't worry fellas, there's a limit to the agreed thoughts between us.

When I say I don't worry about what we do to ourselves I mean we deserve what we get. CasRus is correct that we are at a crossroads and the current pandemic is a sign that we are not above redemption if we get it wrong.

However, whilst creatures on this planet come and go, they do so as a result of natural occurances. Our exploitation of natural resourse is artificially impacting on everything that lives on this blue planet and they don't deserve it. If we choose to be idiots then we pay the price.
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by alftupper » 23 Apr 2020, 06:38

Flat Capper wrote: 22 Apr 2020, 23:04
When I say I don't worry about what we do to ourselves I mean we deserve what we get.
:lol: :lol:

so when you say you don’t worry about it you actually mean something else... so I suppose the question needs to be asked, why write it?

Not for the first time on this forum we see Crapper do a u turn. At first I thought it was just his slovenly composition but I’m beginning to wonder. Crapper is there something amiss with you, maybe an ism or something? Please let us know so we can make allowances for your muddled musings.

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by Flat Capper » 23 Apr 2020, 10:48

Here we go, trying the diversion tactic of personal insult again., sad, sad, man that you are.

I'm not sure what's hard to understand? What will be, will be.

Having survived a life or death situation when I was 20, I take each day as it comes and see them all as a bonus. Consequently, I do not worry about what we do to ourselves as by-and-large, it's in our hands and we do not have a devine right to exist.

If we cannot feed the mass human population, nature dictates that we will reduce the numbers to a more manigable level by starvation - so be it.

However, it's a different matter when our actions impact on the innocent and wonderful world of other creatures, we shouldn't impose our fate upon it.

I truly feel sorry for you Alfie Babe and I do hope your carers have got full PPE?
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasRus » 23 Apr 2020, 12:01

Flat Capper wrote: 23 Apr 2020, 10:48 Here we go, trying the diversion tactic of personal insult again., sad, sad, man that you are.

I'm not sure what's hard to understand? What will be, will be.

Having survived a life or death situation when I was 20, I take each day as it comes and see them all as a bonus. Consequently, I do not worry about what we do to ourselves as by-and-large, it's in our hands and we do not have a devine right to exist.

If we cannot feed the mass human population, nature dictates that we will reduce the numbers to a more manigable level by starvation - so be it.

However, it's a different matter when our actions impact on the innocent and wonderful world of other creatures, we shouldn't impose our fate upon it.

I truly feel sorry for you Alfie Babe and I do hope your carers have got full PPE?
Now Now Guys Alf/Capper !

Let's not melt our opinions down to insulting each other to a derogatory level even though we all have in the past - I for one but am trying to learn not to, but sometimes hard for me also !

What has become evident on current affairs is that we have to find a way to be civilised and express ourselves in a manner that is strong and take the mick out of each other but never down to a nasty level as we have a sounding board to sound off on here but let's all laugh in the face of adversity from one another in a reasonable manner and learn to sometimes take it on the chin also !

I can get both sides from you both here and I can see Capper as being realistic in what life deals out and the consequences in our actions as a society and I totally get what and how humans have impacted on other innocent creatures which I find totally abhorrent when you for example start looking at natural habitats being decimated in Borneo and the Amazon and heart breaking to see an orangutan trying to stop a bulldozer and have no power to stop this. We as a species need to take a long hard look at ourselves and start to arrest all these practices and find ways to stop this.

Just to change onto Domestic issues, one thing that particularly made me angry the other day with all this going on is to still see people fly tipping all their junk in the countryside and the "Plankton" of society spoiling it for the rest who care ! - it beggars belief and that's just one very small noted occurrence and there's plenty more other occurrences in all sorts of forms and more of which are a more serious nature !

Now I've made this argument in earlier posts where we cannot sit about giving leniency to dregs of society with all the snowflake penalties dished out that are laughable and we need to start dishing out heavier penalties including hard labour/chain gangs/death penalties to make people start to consider the outcome of their actions and deter them from offending. What's wrong in having burglars/drug runners etc being given chain gang hard labour where they can be used to clean up fly tipping / general rubbish being dumped and also where we can use similar for crop picking instead of importing EU labour where most of their wages go back to their own country and not even benefit our economy of spend in the UK ? How much does it cost to keep a murderer in prison ? - Hundreds of thousands is the answer - this can be better spent on the NHS especially now ! THINGS HAVE GOT TO CHANGE and the UK can make a start from all this and stop snowflake poncing around with criminals dishing out lenient sentences - Harsh sentencing knowing what's in store for you as punishment leads to less incidents - it's common sense ! That's my considered opinion of starting to arrest all these practices and reduce the impact of these dregs in society on the rest of decent folk.

That's my rant for the day out of the way !!!!

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by baldtiger » 26 Apr 2020, 12:36

Not said owt on here for a bit . How does everyone thing the Tory's are doing ?
Personally I dont think they could organize a [REMOVED] up !
NHS still struggling for PPE .. Only report deaths in hospital when they know its at least double that number.
UK firms just exported 5 million items of PPE to Europe after trying to get a response from Tory party for 2 weeks
Burberrys offering to make gowns .. No Tory response , Scotland NHS said for them to go ahead .. And what I've heard there no good :P :P made out of the wrong material . Why the chuff didn't someone in charge make sure they were in the know!
Still not testing ! Germany had all there labs making test kits from January , so mass testing and putting people on ventilators before they were critical hence much better survival rates !!
I could go on lol , but my rant for the day is over too .. Hope all are well and keeping sane :) :)

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasRus » 26 Apr 2020, 15:49

baldtiger wrote: 26 Apr 2020, 12:36 Not said owt on here for a bit . How does everyone thing the Tory's are doing ?
Personally I dont think they could organize a [REMOVED] up !
NHS still struggling for PPE .. Only report deaths in hospital when they know its at least double that number.
UK firms just exported 5 million items of PPE to Europe after trying to get a response from Tory party for 2 weeks
Burberrys offering to make gowns .. No Tory response , Scotland NHS said for them to go ahead .. And what I've heard there no good :P :P made out of the wrong material . Why the chuff didn't someone in charge make sure they were in the know!
Still not testing ! Germany had all there labs making test kits from January , so mass testing and putting people on ventilators before they were critical hence much better survival rates !!
I could go on lol , but my rant for the day is over too .. Hope all are well and keeping sane :) :)
It's too early to tell what and who are falling short and I for one would welcome a full enquiry once we get a grasp of the situation but please bear in mind the logistics of handling this situation is immense and we as laymen are not with the full facts as to lay blame especially as this is a "once in centuries" catastrophe and caught a lot of countries with their trousers down !

I for one was gobsmacked that the England v Wales, Cheltenham Horse Racing and even the last Cas game v St.Helens was allowed to proceed in the knowledge that this was impending disaster on the horizon and how many lives have been lost from not pulling up stumps before these events !! Germany was quick to react and had invested in a much higher inventory of ventilators for example prior to this kicking off but it certainly looks like the UK didn't react as quick and also however a German spokesman mentioned this morning that they were very lucky in certain respects of the spread of the virus while other countries weren't, so luck played a part.

I would also go to say that lifting or not lifting the Lockdown is either way going to cost lives - Lifting Lockdown will exacerbate the spread of the virus while not doing so will also affect lives and livelihoods / economy and bankruptcy / food shortages with knock on effects that will ultimately also jeopardise lives - Devil you do, Devil you don't - a Catch 22 situation !!

There's going to be a lot to learn just by going through this but the blame game is dead easy to start choose whoever is in Governmental Power while those that sit on the fences watching can cast assertions at any time and who is to say if Labour, for example, were in Power would have had similar criticisms of how they were handling in how they were going about it - Fallibility is the preserve of everyone and for any decision being made - it's how you learn from it !

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by Flat Capper » 27 Apr 2020, 01:48

Your last paragraph is interesting as it is pure conjecture. We cannot judge those that have not played a role in the decisions of those in power. Nor can we assume they would have done anything different, better, worse or the same.

The fact is the current government were in power and faced with making difficult decisions. The public had put their faith in them and they cannot ignore their responsibilities.

If they've got it wrong, they must accept their responsibility and acknowledge their blame thus allowing them to move forward in the right direction.

It's pretty clear mistakes have been made and those mistake have cost lives.

The fifth largest economy in the world should not find it difficult to purchase PPE, testing equipment or even medical expertise to prevent the virus spreading. Is there a reason why our political/financial/logistical systems cannot look after the masses?
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasRus » 27 Apr 2020, 10:31

Flat Capper wrote: 27 Apr 2020, 01:48 Your last paragraph is interesting as it is pure conjecture. We cannot judge those that have not played a role in the decisions of those in power. Nor can we assume they would have done anything different, better, worse or the same.

The fact is the current government were in power and faced with making difficult decisions. The public had put their faith in them and they cannot ignore their responsibilities.

If they've got it wrong, they must accept their responsibility and acknowledge their blame thus allowing them to move forward in the right direction.

It's pretty clear mistakes have been made and those mistake have cost lives.

The fifth largest economy in the world should not find it difficult to purchase PPE, testing equipment or even medical expertise to prevent the virus spreading. Is there a reason why our political/financial/logistical systems cannot look after the masses?
Yes well even the great Winston Churchill made mistakes and which cost lives in both offence and defence of this country and he is regarded as one of our greats !

There is no one on the planet that will get it absolutely right given the speed and unknowns of a crisis in which this has materialised within the space of a few weeks. You cannot expect Nirvana - there will always be collateral damage. It's a question of learning from and minimising.

Yes it looks like there may have been mistakes and which potentially has cost lives - it was always going to be an inevitability and which devil you do devil you don't easing of lockdown will also cost lives either way in the near future .

Like I said, there needs to be an enquiry once we get a grip of this crisis and analyse whether there has been any ongoing abject incompetence before we go sounding off without a clear enquiry analysis to base a sound judgement and then have the opportunity to take anyone to task if it is ever shown to be incompetence of unacceptable proportions.

It's like the question of why we sent over to China early days around 200K pieces of PPE which was heavily criticised however they sent us back over a million - would they have sent those million pieces if we had refused to send the 200K pieces of PPE ???? It's too early to make assertions until the total facts are studied.

On PPE availability, It needs to be fully analysed and it's not just a question of being the fifth largest economy in the world (which is a narrow sighted point out on your part) - it's the question of availability when everyone and his dog are wanting the same kit at the same time ! Look at the biggest economy America - they are struggling bigger than what we are !! Everyone knows this is one of the biggest problems and I can't see why they are not trying their hardest to get this availability as I am sure they are !

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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by Flat Capper » 28 Apr 2020, 00:18

I'm not entirely sure what an enquiry after the event will achieve other than to prove they got it wrong! It's all good and well saying we can take a full look at everything but it won't bring back all the lives lost to poor decisions.

On which, yes, I acknowledge anybody and everybody is trying to get hold of PPE but it is now apparent that many offers from various manufacturers to provide copious amounts of the stuff have simply not been picked up. I presume our position as the fifth largest economy in the world means we clearly[should] have the capacity to pay for it so let’s get on and make it.

The most important thing about mistakes is to learn from them and I'm not sure any lessons are being learned, more ignored.
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn new Labour leader Lol

Post by CasG » 14 Aug 2020, 08:45

Any other Tory voters think they made a mistake?

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